you can go ahead and go--you can go ahead and break the law.' it's--it's sort of, i guess, the benefit of having the money to--to pay the fine. c-span: but, again, going back to where we started in all this, all these connections--they have airplanes. now you--you allude to them in here, but do the politicians use the airplanes? you know, we hear so often that corporate jets are provided to politicians. >> guest: i--i don't know of a circumstance where they did. it doesn't mean it didn't happen, but i don't know of one. c-span: and the relationship to ethanol and bob dole, what'd you find there? >> guest: well... c-span: and how much federal money goes into adm? >> guest: oh, billions. i mean, adm--every time they talk about recipients of corporate welfare, adm is--adm is always at the top of the list. the--the ethanol program alone is billions and billions of dollars. and you have, you know--the biggest champion of that program for many years was bob dole, and dole was, you know, again, close friends with--with dwayne andreas. and you have a-a